#4. Let’s Dive In: Moving Across The Country
After 17 years in the same city, how do you know if moving across the country is the right idea when you’re looking for a fresh start?
Hello! Today’s issue marks the first installment of my new advice column specifically for curious times readers, Let’s Dive In. In today’s email I will be answering one question in my signature long-form style about moving across the country, which is something I did in early 2022.
If you want to ask me a question for a future issue, use my Google form, or DM me! Although long questions and even longer answers are my strength, not every question has to be super lengthy and detailed; once I receive enough shorter ones to answer, I will put them all in one issue together. Otherwise, you can expect one or maybe two questions answered in every future issue of Let’s Dive In.
Although I’m not an expert in most of the topics I cover, I’ve been through just enough in my 33 years to be dangerous. I’ll give thoughts and advice with a compassionate ear and lean on my personal experiences and those of my friends. If I need to consult someone to answer a question, I will. They may also be featured! If you ask me a really good question and I feel like I can’t do a good job answering it, I either won’t (and my apologies in advance), or I’ll consult an expert.
I also promise to take this seriously! I wrote into a very popular advice column once and they answered my question, but got hung up on one unrelated detail (that they misunderstood completely) and ended up kind of taking a shit all over my question when I genuinely wanted advice, lol. I will do my absolute best not to do that and I hope this column is a positive, productive experience for everyone involved.
So without further ado… let’s dive in!
Hi Kelly! Long time follower of C&C and I’m curious: How did you decide to make the move back to the Midwest from LA? And how has it been for you REALLY? I currently live in Seattle and I’ve been here for 17 years. After a few years of Covid and divorce, I’m considering a move back to Wisconsin to be near my family. I’m currently in the stage of overthinking and being super scared. And I also know I’m ready for a fresh start. Ahh! HALP. So my questions are:
When/how did you know you were ready to move?
What steps did you take as you considered a move?
What’s your opinion of the move now?
Looking back, would you do anything differently?
What advice would you give me as I contemplate this?
Eek! Thanks for reading. –Kelly
Dear Kelly!!
It felt right that the very first issue of Let’s Dive In was a Kelly talking to a Kelly. You’re contemplating a very big move–something I did almost a year ago–and I know it’s scary to think about. I spent several years considering heading back to Minnesota before I actually did it, and when the time finally came, I was so ready. This question is focused a little more on me and my own experience than the typical question that is submitted to my advice column, so I’ll try to balance my answer between a personal essay and focusing on your situation as much as I can.
I moved to Los Angeles a month after graduating from college in the summer of 2011. I was young, hungry, and nervous, but excited to start my career in “the big city.” A one bedroom apartment in a safe neighborhood in LA was still $1,450 (and I shared it with someone I knew from college), there were no Instagram influencers yet, and Kim Kardashian was married to Kris Humphries. We had no idea what a “coronavirus” was and most of us with 9-5 jobs still worked in an office. What a time to be alive!
I won’t bore you with all the details, but I got serious about eventually leaving LA around 2018 when I was finishing up grad school at USC. I had been living in near permanent sunshine for seven years, and it was getting less and less appealing to me as the years wore on. The cost of living kept going up at the same rate as my discontentedness. Although I loved my friends (mostly transplants), I never felt like I actually vibed very well with the city itself. LA always seemed a little like it was filled with people who wanted to be doing something else. And as someone who didn’t work in entertainment, I never had anything tying me to the city.
I had my sights set on moving back to Minnesota before the pandemic, which I think may come as a surprise to some. The example my partner loves to cite to prove it to other people when we’re telling “my story” is that I bought a new car in the fall of 2019–specifically with four-wheel drive and heated seats–because I knew I’d be back in Minnesota sooner or later. After ending an engagement, getting a lot of therapy, and enduring the first year of the pandemic on my own, I started putting actual plans into place in 2021.
The very first step that I took when considering my move was understanding my motivations. I ask this to you, too: Why do you want to move back to Wisconsin? There are no right or wrong answers here, but I think digging a little bit deeper into the problem you’re trying to solve with moving could reveal some helpful information to chew on while you ponder this decision. Until you know what your motivations are, you won’t really know if moving is going to solve the problem you want it to solve.
Another factor to consider is your job/career and the ramifications that a new city might have on your work life. Will living in Wisconsin help, hurt, or have a neutral effect on your career? For many years, one major thing that held me back from leaving LA was knowing that the job opportunities for me were so much better in a city where a lot of fashion and lifestyle companies are located. But one positive result of the pandemic was the new world of remote work. Once it was on the table that I could keep my job and move to Minnesota, it felt like the last true hurdle had been cleared. I am super fortunate to have a team that allowed me to leave LA and stay with the company! This might not be the case for you, and something to carefully consider while you mull all of this over.
I absolutely love Seattle (I’m definitely the person who probably gets a little too excited about Pike’s Place Market), but I don’t know enough about it to offer any real advice about the city itself and how it might factor into your decision making. I was curious (heh) so I did a little research and found out a few interesting tidbits that I’ll list here because I didn’t know a lot of these:
PROS of Seattle:
Proximity to nature
No state income tax (but sales tax of 10.25%)
An abundance of jobs, especially in Tech, with companies like Amazon, Boeing, Starbucks, Nordstrom, Nintendo, Microsoft, and many more
Stellar food scene
CONS of Seattle:
High cost of living (shockingly, right up there with Los Angeles)
High cost of housing (the average price of a house in Seattle, according to several sources I looked up on Google, is in the $750-$850K range, yow!)
Homelessness
Cloudy
Traffic
Lack of diversity
Wildfires
The city of Los Angeles itself–which has a lot of similarities to Seattle–was a huge reason I wanted to move. As one of the most expensive cities in the country, the biggest motivator for me to head back to the land of 10,000 lakes was the rapidly increasing housing costs in LA. It was a barrier I knew I would probably never surmount no matter how hard I tried. Owning a house someday soon was something that became important to me shortly after I turned 30, and I knew I wouldn’t be able to do it in LA on my own or with a potential future partner. For me, staying in LA meant either moving to the Valley, buying a small condo, or renting possibly forever, none of which appealed to me in the long term.
And let me be clear–I have friends in LA who do or have done all of these things I listed above, as well as friends who are fortunate enough to own property in LA! Owning a house is not something everyone needs or wants to do, but I knew it was the right thing for me. Having more space and not sharing walls were the main problems I was trying to solve for, and it couldn’t be done in the way I wanted in LA, end of story.
Even renting in LA was starting to feel impossible–when I left, I was paying $2,400/month (utilities not included) for a 650 square foot one bedroom apartment on a busy street–and I wanted more financial freedom. I would catch myself daydreaming about a spare bedroom and a backyard I could sit in on more than one occasion. I knew people in Minneapolis/St. Paul who were buying beautiful houses for around $350-$850K, and I wanted to be one of them. So a huge factor for me was financial, and in that respect, I don’t regret a thing.
A second motivator for me was the overall vibe in Los Angeles. I had a super solid group of friends in LA (gahhh–I miss you all!), but I was constantly interacting with people outside of my close friends that I struggled to find things in common with. My love life suffered most of all. I spent a decade trying and failing to find my person, enduring no less than 10 short-lived relationships that almost always ended in heartbreak, and at some point I started to wonder if it was because the right person for me just wasn’t in the LA dating pool.
Well, it turned out that hunch was spot on. I had barely stepped foot back in Minnesota–had quite literally just dipped a single toe into the Minneapolis/St. Paul dating pool–and there my person was. And you know what? He hates Los Angeles. I sincerely cannot imagine him living there, either. Once I found him, it only reinforced my decision to move, and definitely sped up the timeline.
Minnesota has its faults, don’t get me wrong. The weather in the winter sucks, there’s a passive-aggressiveness here that people don’t talk a lot about, and many people around my age are all either married with children and/or in “cliques” that has made finding friends a bit difficult. But I have my partner, we have our house, I have my family and my book club(!!), and I have my LA friends on FaceTime. I am so happy I moved, even if it isn’t perfect. No place is.
So the first step I’d encourage you to spend a lot of time on is examining what you really want out of this move. Ask yourself not only why you want to move, but also why you want to move to Wisconsin, specifically, and see if your motivations actually line up with what will be waiting for you in the Dairy State. I haven’t spent a ton of time in either Seattle or Wisconsin, but I’m pretty sure they’re really different, lol. I know you’re from there originally, but I’m sure a ton has changed (and you have changed!) in the last 17 years. Paul is actually from Wisconsin originally and has a lot of feelings about it. Talk to some non-family members in Wisconsin to get a sense of what their lives look like, and anything else that’s important to you. If you don’t have any friends there yet, let me know! There have to be a few women who live in Wisconsin reading this newsletter who might be willing to chat with you about it, and I’ll do my best to connect you. :)
I think it also might be helpful to make a list of what the tradeoffs are if you were to move from Seattle to whichever city you’re looking at in Wisconsin, and consider how important these things are to you. I wish I still had it, but at some point I made a Los Angeles vs. Minneapolis list, added a bunch of things I liked about each, and assigned weights to each thing (from 1-3) to see where the scales balanced after adding up each column. By leaving LA I was losing amazing weather and all my close friends (huge!), but I was gaining affordable housing, generally lower cost of living, better city vibe, proximity to family, and living in the same city as my partner (although I had already made the decision to move when I met him; on my list I think it said something like “better dating pool”). This was a helpful exercise for me to realize that I wasn’t suffering from “grass is greener” syndrome–I had a very well-informed, practical list of reasons why moving back to Minnesota would probably be the right choice for me.
You’ve been in Seattle for 17 years, so I think you’ve lived there long enough to make a call on whether it’s really the right city for you or not. And it does say something that you haven’t already left. I wonder if you’re craving a fresh start–after enduring a pandemic and a divorce, I can’t blame you in the slightest!!!–that could be achieved without a move. Have you considered a new job? Finding a new friend group? Picking up a new hobby? Moving somewhere else in Seattle? Jumping back into the dating pool? What does Wisconsin offer you (other than family) that Seattle does not? How much is Seattle itself a factor in your desire to move? Do you have an itch that moving won’t actually scratch?
Here’s something to consider: You could always try moving for a year or two to see how it goes, and move back if you don’t like it in Wisconsin. I think remembering that moves aren’t permanent is really helpful! Of course your job/career is a huge factor in all of this that I don’t know a lot about, but maybe you could try hanging out in Wisconsin for a few weeks if you’re able to work remotely and see how that goes. Taking the Midwest for a little test drive at this moment in your life might do wonders for your psyche. And if you move and hate it–you can always move back! I love Minnesota and don’t regret my decision to move at all, but I’m 100% sure that if I wanted to go back to LA, I would be welcomed with open (and screaming) arms. A little part of me is sad that I don’t want to move back! I miss my friends–by far the hardest part about moving for me–and the thought of a homecoming with them all brings a little tear to my eye.
Something interesting also happened after I moved. Ironically enough, I started liking LA a lot more. Without the financial burden of actually living there and thinking about my future in a city I didn’t see as “forever,” so much changed. I started really enjoying my trips back for work and to see friends, and appreciating the things LA has to offer again. Walking around places I used to know so well with the sun on my face while it’s freezing back home is a joy. I love being a tourist in my old city–I know the traffic patterns, how to get everywhere, where the good restaurants are, the weather is always good, and I have so many friends to stay with and visit. It’s so fun!!
Looking back, I’m not sure I would do anything differently. By the end, I was staying in LA because I was having a hard time thinking about leaving my friends and I wanted more time with them. I still do. But we put a lot of effort into our long-distance relationships, and I’m working on making local friends, too. I had just bought an entire apartment’s worth of furniture, so I spent a lot of money on my cross-country move (like so much it makes me a little ill remembering how much it was–for all my furniture and my car, it was close to $9,000), but I don’t regret it at all. I have friends who moved back to Minnesota at the exact same time I did that went a cheaper route, and their story haunts my nightmares.
My move was pretty seamless. All my stuff arrived in Minneapolis on time with only a few broken plates and mugs as casualties. No amount of time would have been enough with my friends. I got to keep my job! Maaaaybe I wouldn’t have moved to Minnesota in February when it was super fucking cold, lol. That was a bit more of a shock than it needed to be. But I’m usually a big risk, big reward kind of gal. I don’t have a lot of regrets in general. And usually my regrets concern the things I didn’t do, rather than the things I was brave enough to try.
My best advice: Figure out why you want to move and make all decisions based on your inner motivation and intuition. What secret are you keeping from yourself around this? What problem do you have that you think a life in Wisconsin might solve? What expectations do you have for this move, and are they realistic?
If you’ve thought about all of this to death and still aren’t totally sure, I say leap. Do the thing that scares you. If you have to backtrack on it later, so be it. Isn’t life about taking chances? If you end up regretting the move, at least you’ll have a good story to tell.
x Kelly
What’s Up This Week
I just finished This Time Tomorrow (my first Emma Straub!) and while the first 100 pages were underwhelming, the last ⅔ of the book was interesting enough to finish in one reading session. I’ll give it a soft 7/10, but here are a list of qualifications that might get you into the 8-10 range on this one:
If you’ve ever lived in New York City
If you were a teenager in the 90s
If you have lost your father (I’m sorry!)
If you aren’t a sci-fi junkie, but love how fun time travel can be in books and movies (think Back To The Future)
If you loved the movie 13 Going on 30
I don’t meet any of the criteria above (except for maaaaybe the last one), so this story lacked a certain something for me. I also take time travel maybe a little too seriously to fully appreciate this book (there is a cat in this novel that never ages and I’m sorry but it was very distracting!!!!!), but I’ll admit it was very sweet.
P.S. If you’re part of (or want to join!) my virtual book club, we’re discussing The Rabbit Hutch on January 17th at 7:30pm CT.
Also, if you want to get a head start for next month, the book for February is Hell Bent by Leigh Bardugo. It’s the sequel to one of my favorite books I read during the pandemic; an EPIC fantasy book that sort of gives dark Harry Potter vibes but at Yale: Ninth House. I’m so excited!!! If you haven’t read Ninth House yet and like fantasy, do it!!! Read my review of it here.
Hell Bent just came out yesterday, so we’ll meet sometime in mid-late February to chat about it. Here’s a short synopsis from Barnes & Noble: “Our favorite member of Lethe is back in another tale of murder, monsters and dark magic set among the Ivy League elite. Bardugo's follow-up to Ninth House doubles down on all the sinister intrigue and atmospheric chills that make this mesmerizing dark academia series impossible to put down.”
My song of the week is “Me.” by Julia Piccard, which is a really lovely, low-key cover of “Me!” by Taylor Swift. I didn’t even notice it was a cover until the chorus, and I was like hey wait, I know those lyrics! I hate “Me!” honestly lol and this version is way better. It also immediately made me think of that viral Taylor Swift cover from like eight years ago, the acoustic “Blank Space” / “Style” mashup by Louisa Wendorff. Does anyone else remember this?! Gahhhh, the nostalgia.
A few days before I was scheduled to go wedding dress shopping last week, I felt a zit coming on my chin–a bad one, the kind that hurts when you touch it and sticks around for weeks. I attacked it ‘round the clock for two days straight with a combination of a thin layer of 5% benzoyl peroxide and maximum strength hydrocortisone cream every four hours or so, and that fucker disappeared. It doesn’t always work, but when it does, the results of this match made in heaven are amaaaaaaazing.
I am still processing the final episode of Fleishman Is in Trouble which was an absolute smash, so maybe we’ll circle back to that next week. Obviously on Monday I listened to the first two episodes of Chris Harrison’s new podcast, The Most Dramatic Podcast Ever, and all I can say is wooooooooweeeeeeeeee.
If you didn’t already know, I am an undeniably huge fan of The Bachelor/ette. Next to soccer, it’s my favorite sport. I’ve been watching since 2012 when Desiree Hartsock (now Siegfried) was the lead. I even genuinely liked Chris Harrison for a long time! I went back and listened to his interview with Rachel Lindsay from two years ago for context before listening to these two episodes, which hurled me back in time to what is still the most dramatic thing to ever go down in the history of the franchise, in my opinion. I think Chris Harrison showed his true self in that infamous interview, and not much has changed.
I found his recap/explanation of what happened in the aftermath of that dumpster fire of an interview–which is all he talks about in the first episode, “It’s Time We Talk”–to be a complete non-apology where he still takes almost no responsibility for how bad it was. The entire 58-minute episode was preachy, annoying, and even cryptic at times. When Chris called himself “a bit of an empath” and said that “this job was how he paid his mortgage,” I genuinely laughed out loud. This man was paid $9 million dollars just for his silence after being fired from the show he had helmed for 19 years for being extremely unempathetic to players of color. And now he’s coming out with a podcast???? Where he will very clearly be referencing The Bachelor???? Obviously I am fascinated by all of this and will be tuning in to find out what exactly he’s doing with this new venture (I think he’s going to host a new competitor to The Bachelor this year, I’m calling it now.)
See you back here next week!
K bye,
Kelly